A fantastic first event!

I had the opportunity to participate with the Keio Robotics Grant Prix tournament. At first we were unsure if our long time JA was going to make it back from America to Japan in time, but luckily he did. During the time of uncertainty I was preparing to take over his role as JA by checking with the event partner and letting them know all of the rule changes from last year. We attempted to get more judges signed up but we ended up with only four. This meant for 36 teams we were going to have a really tight schedule on event day.

We took the 20 submitted notebooks and judged them over 3 days prior to the event and the morning of the event before the driver meeting. Yes, several of the notebooks are larger than others and if they did not provide a summary page or a ToC, difficulty was inevitable, but we knew it in advance. On average, it was about 15 to 20 minutes per notebook with a couple taking about 40 + minutes. I was asked by the event partner to skim through them to speed up the process, but I refused and explained that I cannot gather qualitative nor quantitative data reliably if I only skim.

When we started, we had two new judges among the four of us, so we split the experienced judges with the new ones. One of them also chose to get the JA cert as well, which was beneficial to our preparation before going to the pit area. We took about 40 minutes to introduce ourselves, go over the new expectations, and select a few opening questions.

We made it a point to:

  • both focus on what the team members are telling us
  • ask follow up questions that require specific knowledge as a response
  • point to specific areas of code or parts of the robot to have the students explain more about that part/section, and where they got the idea or training for that area (mostly YouTube, a few from previous years exp.)
  • We also let them know in advance that we have already reviewed their notebooks in detail and we have some specific questions to ask. This was helpful for the students to really let their knowledge shine, and not just read a book entry. It was helpful also to see what team members were truly involved and not just told to read a section.
  • if we needed to reflect upon a specific part of the notebook we asked them to open it up and explain more about it.
  • we are also watching for member involvement in conversation, paying attention to the interview, helping each other to explain or show parts of the robot, etc.
  • when finished we thanked them for their time and wished them good luck, then left the pit area and went to a private area with no people around to quickly discuss the interview and write down the detailed points needed for the rubric, then returned to the field right away. This took about 1 to 3 minutes each time and was very efficient because, even though we both were not taking any notes, we both were focused on the students and that clarity followed by immediate out-of-pit discussion facilitated easy recall of the interview.

18 teams to judge for each judging pair is 180 minutes (3 H) of time for the interview and 5 minutes (1.5 H) of off-site discussion.

Driver meeting was at 9:45 am, and after that we started. Luckily, we finished before 2:00 pm and started our review and deliberations.

All in all, the event was fantastic, even though it was back to back interviewing this time (no time to watch them practice or compete).

Great experience, and I am very glad we did the notebooks 3 days earlier.

To facilitate the interview process for the future, I will work with the event partner and JAs to have interview rooms set up and the students need to queue up to our room just like they do for matches or skills. This will eliminate a lot of the trouble of trying to find a team to interview in the pit or practice areas. That should speed up the process.

Lets see.

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One item that helps my events for in person interviews is I try to have 2 to 3 stationary tables for judging. I have 1 to 2 teams roving and watching matches. The one item is I would presort the notebooks and allow only a static time for review of notebooks. I will likely need to limit reviews to 20 minutes per graded notebook. Regardless of size, the time will not be allowed to flex. The summaries will guide the judges to the strong areas, then I will have them look at another area. For this reason, interviewing will be required to help differentiate the teams better. All in all glad you posted this information. It is helpful to see how things are being handled so we can keep consistent.

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John,

I know others last year followed the same pattern. So I am obviously vocal, but I love the fact he was honest and open about it.
I have been pushing to put a cap on the notebook size just for this reason. I totally understand why or how this happens. Trying to find a path foward to make it easier on us as Ja and our judges while perhaps upping the challenge for the kids.

Dave

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Paul, thank you for writing this up in so much detail. Posts like this help all of us judge more consistently.

You were right not to skim. A skim doesn’t give you enough evidence to score fairly.

The guidance John posted covers the other half. When one notebook gets 40 minutes and another gets 15, they’re scored under different conditions, and the scores stop being comparable. A bigger notebook gets more chances to show evidence just because someone spent longer looking.

Teachers who grade a common assessment handle this with three habits:

  • Give every notebook the same time box, whatever its size.
  • Use the summaries to decide where to look first, then check one area the team didn’t point you to.
  • Have two judges score each notebook, and talk through any big gaps.

Pairing your new judges with experienced ones was smart, and I like the interview queue idea. I’d love to hear how it works at your next event.

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Hello John,

I fully understand the rules set, but it is just not physically possible unless I am a computer and can download data at lightning speeds.

The problem with time comes when:

  • Students do not provide a ToC yet still have large books. I cannot just skip the book because time runs out. There is nothing fair about that idea.
  • Other books have no summaries, so if they are large, it might come close to going over the time depending on ToC.
  • Some books are quite small, and they are finished in less than 5 minutes due to a lack of information and maybe 15 total pages.

So, in my opinion as an educator, this time constraint is a guideline, but can you really say it should be a strict law that must be followed? There are always circumstances…

Paul, As I have had 300 slide and 800 slide notebooks. Your argument, respectfully, just defeated itself. By aruging that big books require more time than smaller notebooks. you made the case that the review is a sliding scale to level the field, but since it is safe to assume the top teams know the requirements including review time, you have slanted the grading towards the larger notebooks.

While I will agree with anyone that the larger notebooks are amazing reads, we must all remember this is a competition and the kids make choices. Part of the choices include how long, detailed, overly detailed (in some cases), rehearsed interviews versus knowing and understanding, code creation library or learn it…it is a competition. I had one judge last year spend over an hour and a half on one notebook. The notebook was too long for our constraints. This judge disregarded the decision and did what they wanted and put interviews further behind. Ours is not an easy task. I feel your pains in this regard. As I have been doing it for a few years, I am actively writing VEX and my regional coordinator to work on changes and improvements. I would encourage you to do so as well. I am a chemist so having an educator pushing for changes or even if we start a new topic to discuss how to improve things for next year, I am game.
One additional item the JA training informs us to prioritze notebooks with summaries over those without for the very reason you have stated. It is one major change/improvement over last year. When I do the initial sort, I will select the best notebooks. I will than rank only those with summaries followed by the other notebooks. The kids have been told summaries are needed so it is again a choice they make.

Thank you for your honesty. I cannot tell you how helpful this thread is for me. If I come off as to aggressive, I served in the military before completing my degree old effective style of communication. Highly direct and not very civilian friendly at times. I am trying to improve.
Dave